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[...] Zoner Sports (June 30, 2009) “The Real All-Time Home Run List” [...]
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Baseball doesn’t care about betting????? Ask Pete Rose about THAT one! And the list is NOT what it is; it’s a travesty when somebody can cheat and be called the all time home run hitter. Buffoons like YOU making uneducated statements like that are why people have no clue what a great institution baseball really is. Baseball is about tradition, history, and heroes. Ballplayers like Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire, Alex Rodriguez, and Manny Ramirez only taint what is great about baseball.
Uh…Hank Aaron admitted to amphetamine use during his career. Doesn’t that, under your rules, kind of disqualify him?
Hawkeye, the problem with your righteous indignation is that it’s highly dubious to consider what players in the “steroid era” did as cheating, because the situation was a whole lot more complex than there just being rogue ballplayers with no respect for the game or tradition destroying the record books while poor, noble baseball sat by innocently. I have a very, very hard time calling it “cheating” in the classic definition, given that it was understood what was going on at very high levels within the game, and not only was using steroids generally condoned, it was tacitly encouraged. All those big contracts being handed out to sluggers, all those millions of dollars being made by owners– nobody wanted to kill the golden goose, so nobody did anything to stop it. They’re ALL guilty of tainting the game: the owners, commissioner, union head, managers and coaches, teammates, agents, media, and frankly, the fans, as much as the players who’ve now been caught. (Yes, even the fans. Fans were chanting steroids at Canseco in 1988– they knew.)
So, please. I know it’s a real easy solution to just point fingers at the players who’ve been caught, but it’s wrong. The problem was entirely systematic, and feeling good about ourselves for our righteous indignation with what they did leaves many, many people absolved who don’t deserve to be.
And frankly, as a fan, I don’t want to see the whole era whitewashed and blamed on a handful of players. Baseball should own up to what happened. Hold their noses, put players in Cooperstown whose numbers merit it, regardless of what they did, and say WE ALLOWED THIS TO HAPPEN. You can’t rewrite history– and you SHOULDN’T rewrite history. Keep the list as it is and let Bud Selig, Don Fehr, and everybody else who claims to love the game but pretended they didn’t know why home run records were being shattered in the late 90s live with it– and let’s quit the moral grandstanding already.
I like the Twain quote haha, and if you say that some players were given unfair advantages such as take steroids, you can say the same about players such as Ruth that played during a time when a 100mph fastball didn’t exist
if only griffey never got hurt….
roid users can kiss my astrix
Steroids…seems like everyone goes on edge when that word is mentioned. I had predicted that Ortiz took something when I noticed a substantial drop in his numbers. But nowadays if that happened to someone like Paul Konerko for example you’d say “ah he’s just getting old”. He’s only 33. And we only do that in fear, to pretect the integrity and purtity of baseball. Sad thing is that baseball’s never bin pure, even from the days of Babe Ruth and Jackie Robinson there was always something going around, being used behind the radar and for the time being out of the media’s eyes. This was indead allowed to happen and only now has it finally come out to the attention of the public. Will baseball ever be pure? That’s like asking if all people will ever be treated equal. Maybe someday but not in this lifetime.
Jim Thome was teammates with Manny Ramirez and Albert Belle. Remember Albert? His playoff grand-slam on a 100-mph fastball thrown by Armando Benitez was the ultimate steroid user vs. steroid user battle, unless you’re an NFL guy and you prefer the famed Bo Jackson vs. Brian Bosworth touchdown run.
Thome is strongly suspect. In fact, any who hit 50 or more home runs after Cecil Fielder is suspect. Frank Thomas is suspect, and so is Junior.
If we are lucky, the Ninth Circuit will reverse, en banc, its earlier ruling and allow the U.S. Attorney’s office to make use of the list of 100+ players who tested positive. It will be the most edifying disclosure in sports history if it ever reaches the light of day, and I suspect that there are a lot of players out there, Albert Pujols included, who are still more than a bit nervous about it.
Steriod use does in fact produce more home runs period. Long fly balls become homeruns at a better than 60% rate (using pre-use stats and comparing to post-use).
Amphetamines do not enhance performance, they do alter perception temporarily however but over the long haul do not positively (actually negatively) enhance overall performance.
Good list.
’nuff said.
Yo Derek. I’ve heard some doozies before but you take the cake. You say 100mph fastballs didn’t exist back in the day. Im sorry but Walter “Big Train” Johnson threw harder than Nolan Ryan. There just wasnt any machines to capture it. Dizzy Dean too. Where did you get that info? Did you just make it up? Im just curious.
Are you going to cross out the ones who did “speed” in the past too (Willie Stargell and Mickey Mantle are a couple of players who’ve admitted this.)? This whole exercise is childish and the work of a whiner. Who cares what drugs they took!?! They still hit the home runs! Every era had substances they abused to play through pain and to mentally stay in the game. Remove everybody who used aspirin, caffeine, alcohol, and any number of opiates that were available legally in the past, and you may have an accurate, but nearly empty list.
Babe Ruth played when blacks weren’t allowed in the league, so using this article’s “logic” his numbers are tainted, and should not count.
everybody was doing steroids but nobody put the numbers that bonds put up -no where near it.. bonds was a beast—now a poster boy for roids. wheres all the records that were shattered with others doing the same shit—— NOWHERE—bonds was hof before roids and on another planet with em…….
where’s the list of players crossed out who didn’t play against blacks, latinos, and asians?
oh, no problem with that.
where’s the list with the players crossed out who used greenies and coke?
oh, no problem with that.
I find it interesting that the four players at the top of the page are Latino players. Unintended coincidence or subconscious statement?? -Discuss:
“where’s the list of players crossed out who didn’t play against blacks, latinos, and asians? ”
Yeah it is disgusting that Major League Baseball kept minorities out of their game for so long but that doesn’t mean that the players like Ruth who played then should be removed from the home run list. He wasn’t breaking the rules of the game by not playing against blacks or latinos.
Those who used steroids were/are doing something against the rules of the game.
I like the Twain quote haha, and if you say that some players were given unfair advantages such as take steroids, you can say the same about players such as Ruth that played during a time when a 100mph fastball didn’t exist
@Derek and all – Babe Ruth did not hit the most home runs over his career. The amazing feat was, when he hit 60 home runs, he hit more home runs than most teams! He was the best home run hitter of all time.
Great post. Thanks. Love that stuff.
Athletes back in the day (think Willie Mays times) often took “greenies”, better known as amphetamines. Do a bit of research, it’s not hard to find, might need to thin that list out a bit more.
At full speed the hit doesn’t even look that bad, but slowed down…wow!
Very slightly more consistent? Is that like more gooder?
I think that there should be a wing in the Hall Of Fame called the”Hall Of shame”. This is where people like McG, Sosa, A-rod, Palmiero,Bonds( how could i forget him), Popi,Ramierez all belong. As does Rose for betting on sports. He signed a life-time banishment agreement. Sometimes karma is a bitch.
As far as rico, and people of his ilk, they are always finding racism everywhere they look. Did anyone force them to lie to congress? Did somone force any of those players to do steroids
So, rico are you saying they were set up? Because that s where your statement is going towards? If you lie down with dogs you get up with fleas. Are you scratching yet? Keep the subject to ball where it belongs.
Hello! I cant find any contact info for your site but I wanted to ask you a question. If you could send me an email (my address was included in the comment ID), I would really appreciate it. Thanks!
Jay Booshay
Bob, you said “steroids cannot teach hand/eye coordination.” Well the problem doesn’t lie there. The problem is that with steroids they are taking what would normally be a fly ball that would be an out and knocking it over the wall creating a home run. So the homerun numbers of the steroid users are artificially inflated. I have given up on baseball. I used to love it however thanks to steroids and Bud my love for the game is gone. Why allow the steroid players to play or still be able to get into the HOF if they are voted in? Why just have lifetime bans for gambling? In MHO steroid use and what Bonds and company have done is much more serious than what Rose did. What Bonds and company did affected records and games. What Rose did was bet on his team to win which is meaningless.
That is embarrassing to read. I didn’t think he would be second to last. Good find though
-Bearsbacker
Hope they don’t wash the shirt. Donate to st. Judes for auction, please!!!! Gatorade and all.
FIRE LOVIE MANG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
Bahahahahahaha! More Lions rejects heading to Chicago. I LOVE IT! I also heard that they’re looking at Mike Martz as a offensive coordinator. Ah yes, things are getting better and better at Halas Hall. FIRE FORD MANG!!!!!!!!!!!!111
Great Post! Thanks
I bet my mom would let me keep that bear as a pet!!!
People will never cease to amaze me at just how creatively stupid they can be.
Stoeten, above, says it best. I salute you, Stoeten.
This is stupid. It happened and there’s nothing McGwire can do to get you guys off your high horses.
wow–we’re blown away by your argument.
Who cares you media people are idiots… but not more than the people that buy it. Good luck with you sales and the idiots who buy it……………………………………
Lol, Thats the great thing about sports you play to win. Love when they point out the obvious. Love tyour videos.
haha remix! sweet
Too bad Herm isn’t still coaching the Jets… they could have used his advice yesterday.
no surprise on the tweener Hansborough…dude is built for basketball in Israel or Siberia
he isn’t much of an NBA player
Really El? This coming from a person whose name means “the”?
It’s starting to become apparent that TLR has fashioned his whole career out of surrounding himself with players and personnel that serve as a buffer to his “ignorance”. It seems like there is not much of a legacy there after all. Neither one of them have made any kind of substantial statement in all the years since this has happened, and Pujols et al seem to only be drinking the Kool-aid.
I, too, like to be angry and self-righteous about baseball statistics.
I think he was about to start crying.
I’m pretty sure that’s a Chinese accent
I agree that McGwire should have just admitted that he cheated and the steroids helped him hit more homers. Obviously La Russa is backing him because he’s loyal to a fault and he just hired him to be the hitting coach. But I also understand the other side of this controversy too. What more do the admitted steroid users have to do to get the sanctimonious fans and media to move on? Should we string them all up by their testicles in public? And why do some athletes almost get a free pass when they admit to using, but others don’t? I don’t remember seeing any of this outrage when known steroid users like Pettite and Rodriguez were playing in the World Series this year. In fact, nobody even mentioned it.
Bottom line for me is that as long as there is billions of dollars at stake and the potential to make a piece of that money, you will have numerous athletes who will take something to get an edge over the competition. It’s just the way it is. Does that make it okay that these guys cheated? Of course not, but steroids is just the latest in a long line of illegal drugs that athletes will take to give them an edge. So if any of you folks honestly believe that this will bring an end to this kind of controversy, prepare to be disappointed.
Oh, and for the record, I’m a Cardinals fan and I’m biased. The blogger who wrote this is a diehard Cubs fan and his hatred for the Cardinal organization is beyond reasonable.
McGwire’s case is much different than Pettitte or even A-Rod. But let’s for example talk about the right way to do it: Jason Giambi. He admitted it, said it was wrong and no one held it against him anymore. o one wanted to “string him up by his testicles” because he didn’t try to continue the lie.
It’s guys like McGwire, Bonds and Clemens that people can’t stand– trying to qualify their usage or admitting it but claiming conditions on it. McGwire has admitted it was wrong to do it but claims it was a “mistake” and that he only did them to stay healthy, which is the biggest joke of all. I also think he did this to get back into the game. If he wasn’t the new hitting coach he wouldn’t have come clean–he’d have kept hiding from the limelight.
My being a Cubs fan has nothing to do with this. Look at how much I rip on Sosa and he hasn’t even admitted it yet.
But just wait until Pujols gets caught. Then you’ll really think I hate the Cardinals.
Boom goes the dynamite.
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yes, you were first; now shut the f*ck up.
She is pretty woman right nothing with that teeth.